Step 2: Determine the room's center. LONDON. How did this project turn out? Euler: A baby on his lap, a cat on his back thats how he wrote his immortal works (origin? The foam core surrounded by synthetic cloth on both sides and adhered with resin glue is. Underlayment is designed to smooth out uneven areas of the subfloor and form a rigid layer that prevents the flooring from bending. Using cement board and a sheet membrane . Fiber cement board is available in 1/4-inch and 1/2-inch thicknesses. Just wondering how effective is the tile on kerdi membrane vs the traditional cement backboard where tiles are glued directly to the drywall? This will prevent water from entering from behind the membrane, and will provide a more secure waterproof layer. Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. Answer (1 of 3): Schluter recommends applying Kerdi over drywall for walls, however, my local building code will not permit this practice - the local building code requires cement backer on the walls of a shower enclosure, therefore, I have done this successfully many times. Will add it in. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. However, if installed on drywall, it only protects one side. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Kerdi Board as a whole is much easier to install than Cement Board. Cement board (cbu) is not waterproof, but is not damaged by being wet. Actually if you watch any pros work (not on crappy shows) on TV you will see them use backer board 99% of the time. Glass mat gypsum board is a better choice. Mike Holmes uses backer on his show. I appreciate your help and your quick response. If youre not careful, the boards can also leave behind abrasive sandy crumbs that can cause damage to your shower base or tub. We don't expect people to master this and in fact I know maybe two guys in my area (live in big city) that could do this. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. On the downside, the cement boards are heavy, somewhat difficult to cut and can leave abrasive sandy crumbs that can damage tubs and shower bases if youre not careful. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Step 3: Apply Thinset. A complete schluter shower kit is like $700-$900 depending on the size - this includes the pitched foam shower pan. Hang the cement boar. How do I align things in the following tabular environment? As far as the tile/prep work, you are right that he is shifting the blame. You peeled it off? When it comes to applying KERDI, however, it is advised to use a regular thinset that includes portland cement as its main component. It works well, is what Schluter recommends and I've never had an issue with it. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. Yes, it is possible to put Kerdi over regular drywall. However, a cement board is generally easier and less expensive to replace if a repair is needed. This allows for future compression and an area at the corner where things are more forgiving. One of the company says they are going to apply kerdi membrane on the drywall, then tiles onto the kerdi membrane, and as such as cement backboard would not be required. DIYers on this forum seem to have nothing but problems with Hardi. The Schlter system tends to be more durable than a cement board, but it also depends on the particular application and the weather. (3ft-3in wide)Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving . Cement board is a good, reliable backer board that works well on both floors and walls. Problem with very thick cement board/ tile/bullnose edge, Steam Shower Slip Joint Detail - The secret is in the boarding stage. After roughly two days I would fill the corner with silicone. For all the substrates listed in this Handbook (e.g., gypsum board, cement backerboard, etc. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? A 1/2-inch thick, 3 x 5 foot sheet weighs just 7-1/2 pounds, compared with 45 pounds for a similar size sheet of cement board. Cement board sucks up the moisture and as a result, the kerdi doesn't always stick as well to cement board. I would get someone else. There is a product called Kerdiboard you might want to look into. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. When installation is done properly, Kerdi membrane offers a waterproof barrier that can protect the plywood below from moisture. Whether or not you need a Kerdi membrane is a factor of use. Using self-leveling underlayment takes careful prep work. How to adhere edge of bullnose tile to drywall as trim for shower/tub surround. @JimmyFix-it - hardiboard is not really porous unless it is completely saturated. True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? Additionally, you can use KERDI-BAND around corners, seams, and joints to help with a waterproof installation. On a vertical surface, very little moisture . Is this overkill? First, felt paper is stapled to the floor and covered with expanded metal lath. That's the way us "Tile Guys" do it all the time. This will ensure a strong bond between the KERDI membrane and the substrate. Depending on your project and the specific cement board you are using, you will want to select a thinset appropriate for both.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_15',158,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2-0'); The two primary criteria to help guide your selection are the type of cement board you are using and whether you are installing it indoors or outdoors. Learn about the options in exterior siding before you choose, Before you pick up a single tile, pull from these tips for expert results, Slip resistance, curves and even the mineral content of your water all affect which tile is best for your shower, We help a Houzz user ask all the right questions for designing a stylish, practical and safe shower bench, This isn't a light DIY project: You'll need heavy-duty tools and plenty of protection for your home and yourself, In steamy quarters, tile needs to stand up to all that water and vapor in style. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_27',168,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0');if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_28',168,'0','1'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0_1');.narrow-sky-1-multi-168{border:none!important;display:block!important;float:none!important;line-height:0;margin-bottom:15px!important;margin-left:auto!important;margin-right:auto!important;margin-top:15px!important;max-width:100%!important;min-height:250px;min-width:250px;padding:0;text-align:center!important}Waterproofing should also be done on other areas in the shower as well such as the corners, window sills and other areas where water can easily accumulate. Its important to note that Kerdi membrane is not a structural base layer, so plywood should be installed and reinforced as necessary based on load requirements. I used this to seal a 3 1/2 by 6 1/2 foot shower with 7 foot walls. First Kerdi can be installed on drywall or cement board. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. Run a damp towel over the cement board surface to dust . Once the primer is completely dry, use a roller or brush to apply a coat of your chosen KERDI membrane adhesive over the entire surface of the wall, overlapping the edges slightly for full coverage. After installing your mud bed, make sure it is fully cured before applying Aquadefense. Since KERDI is impervious, it does not deprive the mortar of its moisture. A lot of folks like using cement board but it's heavy and requires a waterproofing membrane over it. However, the answer you provided above suggests that the OP could omit a waterproof membrane, that I. Yes. On the other hand, a Schlter system offers improved thermal insulation, which can help to reduce heating costs. When applying the primer, make sure to cover all surfaces thoroughly, as these will be completely covered by the KERDI membrane. In general, modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. I think I'll try using the thinned mixture of Redgard and then try the Kerdi membrane again. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. You probably have to go to a big box store's special order desk or find a specialty tile supplier to find it. Hardie board is thirsty, but that's way too fast. What are the differences between "paperless drywall" and "cement board"? Kerdi board is a kind of waterproofer because these kinds of boards are made of XPS foam. In . I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. We installed cement board on the walls, and today when we attempted to apply the Kerdi membrane we could not get it to adhere. Even the tiling subs have moved away from mortar walls because of the labor cost and lack of craftsmen in the industry. If you ensure that silicone goes in and that the thin-set and grout do not bind there you should be good to go. Sloped Shower Tray KST1220/1525 - The Home Depot. This allows the cement to properly hydrate, resulting in To ensure the floor is clean, wipe it with a wet sponge. RedGard, on the other hand, is a liquid waterproofing membrane made by Custom Building Products. Spacers are the next step. We also found that using a heavy rolling pin worked wonders for really setting the Kerdi. How do you show the depth of a hole in a drawing? Porcelain and ceramic tiles are stiff and hard materials, so if they are installed on an unlevel or bouncy surface they are highly susceptible to cracking. I've never had a failure. Cement board, Wedi board, Kerdi board, Hardibacker, Densshield, Durock, Permabase, or Wonder board . When applying Kerdi membrane to cement board, the edges and seams of the membrane must be lapped, meaning that each layer should overlap the portion underneath it by a minimum of two inches. And by 'booking the Kerdi' I mean we put it in the bathtub, sprayed it with the handshower, then booked it (just like wallpaper). A.Sean Gerolimatos, technical services manager for Schluter Systems, responds: With a few exceptions, unmodified thinset mortar is required for setting ceramic and stone tile over Kerdi membranes (800/472-4588, www.schluter.com ), as well as for bonding overlapped seams and connections to Kerdi drains. The completed assembly takes the place of more traditional backer board when installed over 3/4-inch wood subfloors. Hardibacker is a VERY "thirsty" material that sucks the moisture out of the mortar VERY quickly and I don't like it. This is a very effective and popular method of installing tile, and one that ensures the tile doesnt crack. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Installation. Yes, Hardie board needs to be waterproofed. If you can paint a wall, you can use RedGard. Ditra is manufactured in a 3'3 width and comes in various roll lengths (54sf, 150sf, and 323 sf). This thread is 9 years old and it's the Hardi board that's thirsty not the Kerdi. Step 4: Place the Tile. Wedi showers feature a pre-sloped base that is already installed. Do the prefab Schluter niches like the double unit 12 by 28shelf have a built in pitch to the bottom and middle shelves to drainoff water as shown in niche that you built in that thread? It is a topical waterproofing layer that is put over the substrate to keep water from getting to the wood frame and nails. Good luck with your project. x 96 in. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. . For the floor, he should've put a mortar bed, then a membrane that goes over the curb, then another mortar bed. I would avoid Hardi, as Avanti is right that it is thirsty. Ratings (91) (5) (91) (3 . Here's how to get it right the first time, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Step 4 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick your waterproofing materials and drain, and don't forget to test, Work with your contractors and installers to ensure a safe, stylish curb that keeps the water where it belongs, Get the benefits of a time-honored ritual without firing up the coals, thanks to easier-than-ever home steam systems, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, Out With the Old Tile: 8 Steps to Prep for Demolition, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower Waterproofing and Drainage, Steam Showers Bring a Beloved Spa Feature Home. But you might be struggling to figure out what kind of paint to use on garage walls. With so many different types of underlayment to choose from, it can be hard to decide which is best for your project. Unlike cement boards, you can bend this material without it breaking. True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. #2. ;). To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. I always install it over cement board or backerboard, never over drywall, even blueboard or the mold resistant greenboard. To ensure that the Kerdi is completely dry prior to tiling, inspect the inside of the membrane for any signs of moisture or condensation. They are absorbed into the surface material and help keep moisture away from the substrate surface. No, you do not need to install a vapor barrier, as Kerdi Board is the vapor barrier. A quality underlayment will also serve as a waterproof barrier between the subfloor and the tile surface. So long as the seams and joint areas are properly prepared, the panels can also provide waterproofing. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_17',164,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');As an added precaution, you may want to consider to adding a water-resistant layer afterwards, such as a caulking or flashing tape. This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. Finally, use a roller or brush to ensure that the membrane is secure and has no wrinkles or air bubbles. Modified thin-set mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce and form a hard . That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. Building Panel: Price $ 119 00 $ 202 06 $ 279 00. This liquid waterproofing solution does more than keep water away, it also promotes tile adhesion and prevents cracking. But I can't give you a +1 because telling someone to mortar all the walls in a large shower is like telling them to make an ice sculpture. If done according to manufacturers instructions, it will seal nicely. Aquadefense is approved by IAPMO for use as a shower pan liner, but be sure to check your local building codes, as some areas of the country still require the PVC liner. ", Signed,Never Hung Kerdi A Day In Her Life. Once you have selected the right sealer, follow the manufacturers instructions and apply a generous, even coat over the entire surface of the Hardie board. tripadvisor car rental tampa airport xnxx big tits; roommate questionnaire google form shadow of the dragon queen deluxe; cities where home prices are rising 2022 beachbody bodi block; mahogany tree seeds uses No bulges either, but definetly no thin spots.-Not paying attention to the direction of the comb. Once this is done, continue the installation by following the directions for the particular Kerdi product being used. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. The benefit of using kerdi is we can lay it over drywall, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup. RedGard On Hardibacker Board. It could take longer if the space is particularly wet or humid. Since the existing wall board will be removed, I'd prefer to go a little extra and install a water proof cement board type base so the tile has a solid substrate even if it were to get wet, such as from a plumbing leak, or from infiltration on an exterior wall (as unlikely as that might be). The shower tray eliminates the need for a mortar bed. If there is no blocking behind the seam, i would just tape prior to installing the membrane, the thinset will fill the seam and embed the mesh. I have used kerdi, and I have applied it over cement board. The Kerdi is essentially replacing the backerboard. that's home depot homeowner installation method. ), Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Tile can be installed directly over Kerdi-Board using the thinset method; For use with ceramic and natural stone tile; Return Policy; California residents. Keep in mind that most tile setters err on the side of caution and brush a waterproofing membrane on top of cement board when it is in wet areas like showers or tub surrounds. I simply sponge off the excess. Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. You'll know the RG is dry when it turns reallllly dark bright red as opposed to the pinkish color when applied. Backerboard plus a waterproofing membrane like Redgard is all that is needed for tub surrounds with thinset then tile. Like cement board, the boards are heavy and hard to cut. This is often accomplished by filling any holes and cracks in the wall with appropriate spackling or patching material. I circled one area, but there are lots of these edges." - Lisa Jasper The Kerdi band should be smooth and flat - not wavy/ "3) there is no membrane of waterproofing on the hardboard across from the "wet wall" after 5 1/2 feet up. Ready to join the 100,000+ homeowners matched with pros? Now there's nothing particularly wrong with fiber-cementit's just not my first choice. . Cement board comes both in 1/4-inch-thick and 1/2-inch-thick versions. Well, DH said he had virtually no time to work with the stuff before it dried out, so he switched from my spritz bottle to a sponge. Not to mention, its warrantied by Schluter, giving you the ultimate peace of mind. But there are downsides. In the worst case, it's OK to cut the Kerdi, remove the damaged section, scrape up the thinset from the areas, and set a new piece of Kerdi. When installing KERDI with unmodified thin-set mortar over particularly dry and porous substrates, it is recommended to wet the substrate first, in order to help prevent premature drying or skinning of the thin-set mortar. You troweled on thinset combing it out then pressed the Kerdi into place? Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! Step 7: Cut the Tile. What? Following the correct application of Kerdi membrane over cement board will ensure a successful waterproofing installation and lasting results for your tile project. http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/en_US/Shower-System/KERDI-SHOWER-KIT/Schluter%C2%AE-KERDI-SHOWER-KIT/p/KERDI_SHOWER-KIT, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup. Kerdi-Board panels allow the installer to prepare and create a broad range . If a pipe or faucet ever leaks in the wall this will ruin your shower. I look at ceramic tile as a lifetime-of the house-product, so I use the best material for the job.I prefer to use cement board as the substrate with the Kerdi on top. Once you have determined the type of thinset, its important to also consider the weather conditions during installation. I have to redo my tub surround due to moisture leaks and failing grout. When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. What do you mean it doesn't adhere? Need help liner vs liquid membrane question. Installing cement board involves placing the boards atop a layer of thinset adhesive, a process known as bedding. He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. We were using a 3/16 x 5/32 trowel, probably to small. It also helped me to work in smaller sheets. Cement board is a bit better, but you need to spray either one before applying the mortar so that it doesn't "skin over" before you can get the Kerdi up. A hundred times better to have too much before you comb than too little. The mortar does . Project Type: Tile / Category: Bathroom. Install the drain adapter, if needed. Schulter Ditra is manufactured by Schluter Systems and is a 1/8 thick polyethylene uncoupling membrane that is specifically designed for tile installations. This feature makes building the base structure much easier and more cost . Dean, our tile consultant, says glass mat backer board is his first choice due to the ease of installation, cost, and because his workers like it. It fell right off? :/. We use a pump action garden sprayer and its usually dry by the time we clean the sprayer. What was the indicator that let you know that spritzing was not enough, and that you needed to 'sponge' the Hardi? New England. The grid lines on the surface are incredibly helpful for installation and making neat cuts. Because it can let some moisture wick through it, you have two choices: put a moisture barrier behind it to protect the structure, or, waterproof the front of it. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. Thanks. This will ensure that the coating sticks to the cement board. RedGard can be used on a wide range of interior and exterior surfaces. Using Kolmogorov complexity to measure difficulty of problems? You don't want to block off the end of the air chanel and trap half a sheet worth of air under there.-Not paying attention to the direction of my knife. And we are using a drippy mixture, it slides off the trowel. Self-leveling underlayment has many of the same advantages as a dry-pack mortar bed but doesnt require as much skill to install. Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4HjHT6_cUo, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEt6irjJCI0, My master suite addition & full bath to 1/2 bath renovation. I can take a bit of it off the wall and roll it into a ball. It is important to waterproof Hardie board to make it more water-resistant, as well as to protect the materials from the elements. This is the traditional tile backer. Kerdi Board is suitable for a number of interior applications. Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. PROBLEM SOLVED for Tub Flange when Installing Cement Board and Tile. Seams and joints should also be waterproofed and caulked to prevent water from seeping through. I barely touch it with my hands before going to the tape knife. Once the membrane is in place, it can be sealed and reinforced with Kerdi-Fix sealant, Kerdi band, and Kerdi-Drain for added waterproofing strength. To create a watertight shower assembly, we installed Schluter's Kerdi membrane over the drywall, just as we would for tile.Write by:. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Kerdi is not a user friendly product, and when you shrink your working time down it is downright stressful. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. This creates a strong, waterproof tile backer that also functions as an uncoupling membrane. I also used a larger sized trowel than the one recommend by Schluter. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. For indoor projects and gypsum board, thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is ideal. Fiber cement board is a variation of cement board that is made from compressed cement and sand and reinforced with wood fibers throughout. Moisture resistant can cause similar problems, and there is absolutely no advantage to it. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried using a larger notch trowel, but nothing seems to make the Kerdi stick.
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